Loco Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 New to G Scale! Recently, while working in the garden, I remembered the LGB track (about a 20' oval and 2 switches) I never set up. Also I have Bachman Spectrum Heisler and Shay engines. My son's 11th birthday is coming up and I would like get the track set up in the garden and electrified! I want to get my son either Aristo-craft Eggliner (if i can find one anywhere) or Aristo-craft PCC Trolley. I would like to know what I need to buy in order to electrify the track, run the trains and their features, and has sounds. Thanks for your help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Robinson Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 The big question with track power is DCC or analogue. The former may be better for sound. Do any of your locos have DCC and/or sound chips? At least one version of a Bachmann Shay was produced with DCC and Sound as a factory fitted option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 I just checked the Shay and the manual says "DCC Ready Circuit Board," and the Heisler says "DCC Ready - install your decoder (Lenz LE4024 or similar suitable product with heavy-duty amp rating). " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 I really do not know the difference between Analog and DCC - which is recommended? Since the engines are "DCC Ready" - what does that mean exactly? It will be a simple layout only running one train at a time. You mentioned a sound chip - Sound would be great and i am sure my sons would love if the trains made actual sounds they could control. In order to run a sound chip, do i need DCC? Where is a good place online to find the stuff I need? (and what do i need, lol) If I go DCC Route - presumably i need this to use any features of the engines? like sound and such - what exactly do I need to buy? If i go Analog route - what is different? Is it more simple? less options? - you mention better sound. Will both DCC and Analog support stuff like interior, reverse lights, etc? The trolley i want to get my son does not have sound - just light - so if that is modular - perhaps I cat get things in stages Thanks for your help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benshell Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Bachmann engines have a dummy plug you'd remove to plug in a DCC decoder, if you go that way. Unfortunately there are different standards for DCC plugs, but my Bachmann Peter Witt streetcar (a great alternative to the Aristo-Craft PCC) I think it was a 21-pin plugin. There are a lot of good decoders, with and without sound, from QSI, Zimo, ESU, and others. They aren't cheap though. Figure around $200 per locomotive with sound. As for a DCC system, if you wanted to run a lot of trains at once, or have a lot of room to grow, I'd recommend NCE 10amp or Massoth 12amp. Or if you're good at soldering join MERG and get their 10amp DCC kit for small fraction of the cost (that's what I use). But to get started I'd just recommend hooking them up as-is to a DC power pack. Another good thing about Bachmann is they tend to use very efficient motors, so a power pack meant for HO scale would be fine. I still have an old MRC Tech II from the 90's I occasionally use! An HO scale decoder might even be possible in these engines (saves $$$), but make sure the voltage range is enough for your DCC system and any other DCC engines you might have. I use an HO scale QSI Titan-U in a Bachmann Thomas which is perfect for a tiny engine like that. And my streetcar has a HO scale Zimo unit. Otherwise I have mostly power-hungry engines with 6+ amp large scale decoders, and I run my DCC boosters at about 22 volts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 I will look into MERG and the kit - DCC sounds like something that will take more time and money than I have at the moment - so i think I will focus on getting a DC Power Pack so i can captivate my kids interest in the project asap- I already ordered the Aristocraft PCC Trolley - Ok thanks! - I also found some old garden rail magazines of mine i will look at. Regarding the DC Power Pack - is this one sufficient : MRC AG990 Model RECTIFIER Corp. 10 Amp Power Supply - and do I need this?: LGB Type Track Power COnnector Assembly with wires Bachmann? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Loco Welcome to the forum! Look to http://www.railclamp.com/for clamps to connect Landscape Lighting Wire (found @ Home Depot etc) from your power pack to your track. Landscape wire can be buried ,and is wayyyyyyy better than LGB tiny wire connectors for carrying power. This wire is designed to be buried. Good luck and have fun! Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Loco LGB,Aristo,USA track are all 332...They will fit together. Bachmann, Aristo and 99% of engines and rolling stock use this track, so name brands engines etc. are not a problem. Connect each piece tightly. Connect the wire from power pack, one will be + and one will be - to the track. One goes on each rail( this is were those clamps come in handy). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 8, 2015 Author Share Posted March 8, 2015 oK thanks for the responses! I am planning this evening to order a DC Power Supply for my kid this evening - I am considering MRC AG990 Model RECTIFIER Corp. 10 Amp Power Supply - Is this a decent one? I Read about the Aristo-Crafft Train Engineer walkaroud one, but that seems difficult to find. Any recommendations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Hi, That MRC Power Supply is a decent unit but it's max output is 22V DC. Personally my target voltage is 24V DC - 30V DC...That's why I stick with Bridgewerks. Then again to run those Bachmann locomotives the MRC should do you just fine! Wholesale Trains sells them for $230.00 Aristo Train Engineer...I wouldn't bother with that as those folks are out of business. Bridgewerks does make a add-on radio control walk around unit if all you want is to vary the voltage on the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grsman Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Crest has a very nice unit with walk around and plenty of power. You will find these at http://www.crest-electronics.net You can download the manual for it to find out a little more. THE CRE57004SD BASE STATION/SUPER RECEIVER SET TRANSMITTER & RECEIVER 2.4Ghz W/SOUND. 24V 15 AMP MAX RECEIVER REPLACE OUR CRE5470 TRACK POWER OR RECEIVER CAN BE USED IN TRAILING FOR BATTERY OPERATION. PULSE WIDTH POWER CONTROL. NEW LARGER HEATSINK. A COOLING FAN IS RECOMMEND FOR THE BASE STATION RECEIVER CRE55499 LINEAR BOARD AVAILABLE TO CONVERT TO LINEAR POWER CRE57091 Item #: CRE57004SD Manufacturer: CREST CRE57004SD BASE STATION SET SUPER RECEIVER W/TRANSMITTER Be the first to write a review 3 Price: $475.00 Sale Price: $285.00 * Marked fields are required. Availability: In-Stock Qty: * I have one and I like it very much. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Thanks, folks! I have a question about the CRE57004SD --- what is the difference between the SD and SS? I can't seem to find any from the description. This is my understanding of how this works - please pardon my ignorance and correct me so I can figure out what best suits my needs. -- Does this require that i convert engines to Battery Power? NO -- Does this require DCC? NO - Will this electrify the tracK DC by connecting the base unit to the tracks with clamps and wire? YES --Comes with receiver for 1 engine - for each of my additional engines I need to buy one more receiver for each one, and also adapters if they are not Aristo-craft engines - like my Bachmans (can't find the ones wi would need on there either) YES -- To access features a train may have, I can insert different boards to use engine's smoke, sound functions etc via radio waves by the walk around controller - YES tHANKS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Robinson Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 My understanding of the CRE57004SD is that it is a relatively high power set up with a receiver that powers the track. There is no need to fit any receivers to individual locos. Should you wish to run several locos at the same time with independent control of each loco you'd need the CRE 57000 SS or SD for starters. You'll then need additional CRE57002SS or SD receivers, one in each additional loco. I doubt that the CRE57004 receiver has sound so the SS and SD parts of the code are irrelevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grsman Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 My understanding of the CRE57004SD is that it is a relatively high power set up with a receiver that powers the track. There is no need to fit any receivers to individual locos. Should you wish to run several locos at the same time with independent control of each loco you'd need the CRE 57000 SS or SD for starters. You'll then need additional CRE57002SS or SD receivers, one in each additional loco. I doubt that the CRE57004 receiver has sound so the SS and SD parts of the code are irrelevant. The 57004 may be used as an onboard receiver for higher power locos. This has been done by many 1:29/1:32 scale modelers. It is done with track power or battery power. The 57004 is sound capable. It does not function at this time. It will work after the USB adapter becomes avaliable. The 57000 SD or SS are avaliable now with sound. Output is limited to 5 amps. The sounds are generic and limited, but are acceptable to many people. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Ok thanks - ONE QUESTION about the CRE57004SD - I just watched a video on this unit and it confused me a bit because it said the "starter kit has everything you need to install in 1 engine" - so i am confused now as to whether the Crest unit powers the track directly or even attaches to the track to power it. So just to be clear, in order to power my track for one engine at a time, the Crest unit can attach directly to the track to electrify it? (or does int NEED to be installed in an engine) I just want to be clear that I will not be needing a second device to power the track in addition to this Crest unit! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 So just to be clear, in order to power my track for one engine at a time, the Crest unit can attach directly to the track to electrify it? (or does int NEED to be installed in an engine) Thanks! Loco Here is some info for the base station (track unit) http://www.trainelectronics.com/ART5700TrainEngineerRevolution/TrackSideRevolution/NewBaseUnit.htm Quote from review "Your DC power supply connects to the two screw terminals marked INPUT" You still need a power supply! I hope this helps Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Ok I didn't realize that CREST unit also required an additional power supply..... This is starting to price out of my league, lol -- $300 for the Crest unit plus whatever a power supply costs --- what is a decent but fairly cheap power supply I can get and which one? I don't see any on the CREST website Or what about BATTERY use? - looks like I can get a battery and charger from the CREST site for about $130 - is that all I would need if I wanted to go this route? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benshell Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Many people love the Train Engineer Revolution system. I didn't realize they now have a base station meant for powering your track, rather than putting a receiver in every engine. For powering your track I think this would be a fine choice, as would Bridgewerks who has a reputation for the best DC track power system out there. If you need a DC power supply for the Train Engineer, I really like Mean Well. I have a 750 watt 27 volt supply that powers all three of my 10 amp DCC boosters! For most people I'd recommend 24 volts or 27 volts at more like 250 watts. The voltage output is adjustable, so with the 27 volt I can go from about 22.5 volts to 31 volts. If you are considering battery power, I would personal advise going with an Airwire or Airwire compatible system because there are multiple vendors from which you can buy from, mostly CVP and QSI with Gwire, but also homebuilt (see Garden Railways Magazine from last year). If you go with the Train Engineer you are stuck with them. Their standard is not open, so if they are out of stock (it has happened many times before, for LONG periods of time), or they go out of business, you could be unable to expand your roster without switching to another system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benshell Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 By the way, I'm giving a presentation this coming Saturday on power and control systems, as part of the Sacramento Valley Garden Railway Society clinics: http://www.svgrs.org/public-event/march-2015-workshopsclinics This is one of our only public events so you are welcome to come if you can make it... any chance you live nearby? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 Thanks! I am definitely leaning toward that CREST Train Engineer at this point - since I already got my kid the Aristocraft PCC Trolley I am thinking perhaps it would be good to use batteries in that engine (I read Aristo-craft engines are already equipped for batteries - is this true? - then I could save up and puchase a good power supply for the track down the road to power the Bachmans. Does anyone know, can I just plug CRE55610R LI-ON 21.5v / 2.2-AMP 6-CELL BATTERY PACK WITH CREST'S GUARDIAN BOARD PROTECTION CHARGING AND DISCHARGING into Aristo-Craft PCC Trolley, or is there something else that I need? I have not been able to find info on the Revolution system powering the track - instead of just individual engines - still looking - anyone have more info on this? Oh man - that presentation of yours sounds awesome! I live in Los Angeles area unfortunately. Thanks for the invite! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grsman Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Download the manual for the Revolution Base Unit from the Crest site. It will tell you all about it andhow to hook it up. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 Thanks! Wow - this just gets more interesting - and complicated, lol. I think I am starting to close in on what i will get: DC POWER SOURCE: Meanwell SP240-24. Read something about having to make wires for this - sounds weird. Is it complicated? CONTROLLER: Crest Train Engineer: Confused about whether I need the BASE STATION RECEIVER, a plug-into engine RECIEVER - or both. Which of these do I need for this setup? Apparently, the Crest Train Engineer is not plug and play for Bachman engines - would it be a major pain getting these to work with the TE? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benshell Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Thanks! Wow - this just gets more interesting - and complicated, lol. I think I am starting to close in on what i will get: DC POWER SOURCE: Meanwell SP240-24. Read something about having to make wires for this - sounds weird. Is it complicated? CONTROLLER: Crest Train Engineer: Confused about whether I need the BASE STATION RECEIVER, a plug-into engine RECIEVER - or both. Which of these do I need for this setup? Apparently, the Crest Train Engineer is not plug and play for Bachman engines - would it be a major pain getting these to work with the TE? I'd forgotten about this, but the Meanwell power supplies don't come with an AC wall plug. I was able to buy one locally from Fry's Electronics. One side is a typical 3-prong plug, and the other is three bare wires you hook up to the screw terminals on the power supply. You'll also need some wire to hook the power supply to the Train Engineer. The heavier the wire the better of course. For short distances on my workbench I use 18 ga. For running out to my layout I use 10 ga, 12 ga, and 14 ga depending on the length of the run (and what size wire I have available). I think you should get the Base Station Receiver, because then you can run all your engines right now on DC power through the tracks. You can add receivers into engines if you want to convert to battery power later. It will always be nice to have a way to power the tracks for running new engines though, since DC is still the standard for all new engines from every manufacturer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 Thanks! Tentative Shopping List: MISC. - Landscape Lighting Wire (Home Depot) - AC Wall Plug (1 side is 3 prong plug, other side is 3 bare wires) -18ga Wire -2 clamps - power supply connector (standard) brass (does it matter get stainless or brass even though rail tracks are brass LGB?) CONTROLLER: -CRE57004SS BASE STATION SET SUPER RECEIVER W/TRANSMITTER -CFE 55499 Cooling fan for base station DC POWER SUPPLY: -Meanwell SP-240-24 or.... still looking for exact one and rereading above post --- Wow - they have a dizzying array of products - not sure exactly what I am looking for. I believe the one i listed is max 240 volts - so i am trying to figure out what is the next model up from the one i listed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Loco You can use the landscaping wire to connect the Meanwell SP power to the CRE5700ss base unit ..so forget the 18ga wire. "AC Wall Plug (1 side is 3 prong plug, other side is 3 bare wires)" The three prong wire is also @ Home depot..just ask.. its a three prong replacement cord . Keep us informed!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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