rbrown7713 Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Well, I went to my first brass gauge one auction and won this J&M observation car, and what an experience. I was so nervous that I outbid myself., and that is a true story. The auctioneer laughed and said that's ok and didn't hold against me. Then I went to pay for it and looked in my jacket, where I put it because it had so much cash, it wouldn't fit into my jeans pocket, and it wasn't there. I immediately thought that someone had lifted it from my jacket, it scared me and the lady that was taking the payment. Then I checked my pants, and there it was. Wow, what a scare. I am glad that I went, because I met some of the top brass buyers in the world and they took me under there wing and gave me some pointers and I listened. Because of that, I won the observation car. I will use it on my railroad and also use it for dimensions for making more cars, better than a drawing. The auction was amazing, I was surprised at the low prices of the Samhongsa gauge one locos. I still didn't have enough money for one of those, but maybe next time. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BNSF 828 Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Congrats on the observation car! Glad this story had a happy ending. One you'll remember each time you look at the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginear joe Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I've never heard of that car. It looks great. How well does it roll? I like the rivet detailing as well. How much was an engine?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayman4449 Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Great looking car and congrats on the buy. I hadn't heard of them either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted May 2, 2016 Author Share Posted May 2, 2016 The car built by J&M is an English brass builder from England, mainly english and german locos and cars, but they ran a series of these heavyweights a few years back. It is heavy and doesn't roll very well, but I haven't tried to see why yet. The brass locos went for really low prices compared to their new prices. I will try to get the selling prices for you or tell you where you can see them. An FEF went for about 3200. and a bigboy went for about 4500., but those prices I am guessing. Next time, I will have to bring about 15,000, if I want to win any engines. I paid 1100. for this heavyweight, not a bad deal, for my first time, because another observation car went for 1000., so I was right in there. The other 4 heavy weights went from, I believe, 500 to 800. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted May 2, 2016 Author Share Posted May 2, 2016 Here is the link to the closing prices. https://www.liveauctioneers.com/catalog/87545_train-and-doll-auction/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginear joe Posted May 2, 2016 Share Posted May 2, 2016 Wow, those prices were low! I bought the new Accucraft passenger cars and the trucks have roller bearings installed. They roll so easy. I'm trying to install bearings now in all my cars when possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted May 3, 2016 Author Share Posted May 3, 2016 Yes, the prices were low. I talked to one of the big buyers and he said that he didn't know why they were so low either. Almost all of the buyers there were collectors. Those locos will never see the track, unless it is for display, what a shame. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginear joe Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 Wow. that is a shame to me. I run everything I buy. I'm not worried about resale as I won't be around then! Did all those engines belong to 1 guy? How many FEF's alone were there? Shewew. I'd like to get my hands on just one of those high end engines someday. I'm still waffling over the Accucraft electric Allegheny as there's no promise date or even if it will be made, I believe? I should save up for one and pray it comes along. Those Fine Art Models look impressive. I see some floating around. I missed out on a BigBoy electric that was up for bid this past year. I couldn't commit to that kind of money right then. I believe next year will be better for me. Who knows maybe even a used T1 may come along then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted May 3, 2016 Author Share Posted May 3, 2016 Yes, the engines belonged to one person, Col. Alexander, I believe, a retired colonel in the Marines. He died and they were liquidating the estate. I could have bought an FEF for 2100. Well maybe next time. I believe there were seven FEF's. I think some of these engines are popping up on Ebay already. There is a T1 for 9500, There might not be another auction like that one ever. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginear joe Posted May 3, 2016 Share Posted May 3, 2016 I see someone from France selling four of these cars. They do look great. It's funny to me that there's a higher level of cars and engines that were made and it's almost a secret. I bet they all went to collectors and maybe so long ago that it went quiet? The new Accucraft releases seem like they geared towards live steam as if the electric's weren't selling well or worth the effort??? There is the Dreyfus! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
du-bousquetaire Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Hi Bob: I am glad you got your hands on one of these J&M cars they are so far the best that has been offered on the market, although they are a bit on the heavy side, traction wise. It's Ok if you don't have any big grades. I have a 1.8% grade out of my indoor terminal and when I take them up with my MTH GG1 I take them up three or four at a time. The GG1 wiill take the whole rake up, but I prefer being on the safe side about stripping the gears. It is one of my favourite locos. With my scratchbuilt B60 baggage and my D 78 diner I can align 7 heavyweight now! When I use the PA1 A A set it takes the whole thing up easy. Thats one of the reasons, I tell people that MTH locos are good mechanically, they take that kind of beating rather well. Out on the main which is horizontal and wide (11' radius and over) curves it can handle the whole drag plus some lightweights. These cars roll pretty well though and once going give a lot of cinetic energy to a train. This car is an accurate reproduction of the PRR observation used before the fleet of modernism cars introduced in 1938. Ditto for the NYC. the smoker baggage is also correct as well as the 12 section sleeper, only the diner seems a bit too much of NYC origin. Thats why I built my D 78. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 Hi du-boussquetaire, and thank you for your comments. The one that I won doesn't roll very well, so I will attempt to put brgs. in the trucks. The trucks that I am making is designed for brgs. and I am trying to make them to look a little more prototypical. I am sorry, what is a D 78?, my interest is pretty narrow, EMD and Pullman, thanks, Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
du-bousquetaire Posted June 12, 2016 Share Posted June 12, 2016 Well in short most sleepers, parlors and club cars on limiteds (That meant limited to those who paid extra fare and Pullman fees) were run by the Pullman company an important manufacturer of cars that sold the concept of the sleeping car in the US, Canada and Mexico, and operated these cars for the railroads. That is they built the cars, maintained them, equiped them with bedding and linen, and manned them with the famous Pullman porters which represented an important step in the emancipation of american colored people at the time (For many their first real job...). in 1947 some companies that wanted to run their own sleeper services, attacked the Pullman company in the anti trust courts and won. The pullman company was forced to divest itself either of the operation of the cars or the construction of railroad cars. It chose to divest itself of the operation which was taken over by the companies where these cars operated on (Pennsy, NYC, Santa Fe etc.) but provided the crews as a service for these companies. However what most people don't understand was that each railroad provided its own baggage, RPOs diners and even coaches, if the trains had coaches in their consists. There was feirce competition between them and although diners were run at a loss, it was good PR for the companies, like the B&O competed with the PRR between New York, Philly, Baltimore and Washington and the mid west (and with the Erie the NYC the Lackawana-NKP route etc) The B & O couldn't compete with the PRR on speed but it's dining cars were renown for their excellent cuisine, so it was an argument in the case of a more leisurly trip. What that means was that sleepers and pullmans had pullman writen on the facia board whereas all the company cars had written PRR, NYC or AT&SF etc., there. They also built their own cars often very different from those of another company. A good example of this is the Osgood Bradley "American Flyer" cars that the New Haven and a handfull of other roads operated. A very different coach from those of neigbour NYC or partner PRR. The D 78 is an accurate series of PRR diners which the J&M is not (it's a NYC design...) As I am a sobbing, slobery Pennsy freak I try to make it as accurate as I possibly can (Actually I love many other US roads, notwithstanding the AT&SF, the C&O and Virginian and N&W, the B&M and many others, but to simplify things I tend to stick to one prototype to get an atmosphere of a company going on my pike and to reduce my spending. If I could I would buy UP FEF chalengers, N&W 611 NKP berkshire and so on but I would soon be living in the steets...). Passenger trains are a fascinating world... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted June 12, 2016 Author Share Posted June 12, 2016 Where can I find a picture of the PRR D 78? I would like to see one please. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted June 12, 2016 Author Share Posted June 12, 2016 I found a picture of the D 78, and it looks like the one that I am building except for the window arrangement. Are you building one? I need some help with some wheels. I found three axles and wheels around my garage and they fit my 3mm bearing holes perfectly, but I have no idea what they came off of. The hole size of the bearing must be larger than .118, has to be around .120 or .121, because the axle shaft size is .119 and it slips right on. Can anyone identify what they might have come off of? If I can find these wheels to buy, I can save myself the trouble of turning the ones that I have down on my lathe. Well the revised truck sides and the roof are poured and in the morning, I will open them up, it's like opening up a Christmas present in June. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginear joe Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 anyway you can post a pick of the wheels? If that's what you're asking? I only have the mass produced stuff. Maybe someone can help? Usually can tell by the shape of the wheels and flanges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted June 13, 2016 Author Share Posted June 13, 2016 I need some help with some wheels. I found three axles and wheels around my garage and they fit my 3mm bearing holes perfectly, but I have no idea what they came off of. The hole size of the bearing must be larger than .118, has to be around .120 or .121, because the axle shaft size is .119 and it slips right on. Can anyone identify what they might have come off of? If I can find these wheels to buy, I can save myself the trouble of turning the ones that I have down on my lathe. Well the revised truck sides and the roof are poured and in the morning, I will open them up, it's like opening up a Christmas present in June. The measurements are: wheel:2.657, with flange:3.255, and the axle between the wheels is: .268. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
du-bousquetaire Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Hi Robert: There is a good photo of it in the Locomotive forum in the section: Show us your engines on page 9 (just before you showed us your beautiful work on the E units and the LW cars). It is built of aluminum except for the roof which is from an old stock of J&M roofs I was able to purchase, with a plywood floor and runs on David Leech trucks. (which are not accurate for this car actually they had the cast type of trucks with the equalisers hidden in the cast frame). I described its construction fully in an article fort Steam in the Garden a couple of years ago. It makes for a very sturdy yet lightweight car. For the wheels I couldn't say you should check the diameter it should be for passenger trains 36 scale inches in diameter. Freight wheels would be 33" diameter. The flanges are bretty big, otherrwise the wheels look good, it is often a sinch to reduce the flanges, if you have a lathe and a press. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrown7713 Posted June 13, 2016 Author Share Posted June 13, 2016 I found it, it looks excellent, hope my heavyweight comes out anywhere near that good looking. Bob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
du-bousquetaire Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Sure you can your cars and E units are tops! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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